Neal Trotter shared their story and experiences with us recently and you can find our conversation below.
Neal, really appreciate you sharing your stories and insights with us. The world would have so much more understanding and empathy if we all were a bit more open about our stories and how they have helped shaped our journey and worldview. Let’s jump in with a fun one: What is something outside of work that is bringing you joy lately?
Well, what I do as Mid-South for Abolition is outside of work. I have a 9 to 5 office job that pays the bills. I don’t get paid for my Mid-South for Abolition work. It is a passion project. But I suppose it is not simply a project. Mid-South for Abolition is a life long endeavor. It is my contribution to the goal of abolishing police, prisons, and surveillance. I am truly passionate about this goal and working toward it brings me joy, despite receiving no monetary compensation for it.
Can you briefly introduce yourself and share what makes you or your brand unique?
My name is Neal Trotter. I host abolitionist teach-ins under Mid-South for Abolition. Teach-ins are unstructured educational seminars open to the public. I set up in public spaces like parks, courtyards, festivals, concerts, and community events where I share knowledge about abolitionism. Abolitionism is the concept of existing in a world where people feel safe without police, prisons or surveillance. Such a world requires a complete reimagining of our social institutions and our ideas about justice. There is a lot of critical theory, analysis, and research already existing in published books, film, and other media that I share and discuss during these teach-ins.
Thanks for sharing that. Would love to go back in time and hear about how your past might have impacted who you are today. What breaks the bonds between people—and what restores them?
Our current society promotes hyper individualism. This idea that you can and should “pick yourself up by your own bootstraps.” And that you do this by competing with others for money and power. We’re conditioned to believe that life is a zero sum game, that there are only winners and losers, the world is dog eat dog, that you start off as a big fish in a small pond and when you grow up you get into a bigger pond with other big fish and you have to struggle to be the biggest fish. All of this results in hustle culture, consumerism, and late stage capitalism which ultimately breaks the bonds between people. We are so caught up in fighting for resources that we perceive as limited we don’t take enough time forming meaningful relationships with each other. We’re so preoccupied with the false realities of scarcity and independence, we don’t realize we actually have enough resources and what we need are each other to survive and thrive.
What did suffering teach you that success never could?
The idea that suffering leads to success is a lie. Pain is not progress. Progress is not pain. It goes back to the core concept of abolitionism. Success is the result of communities of care and networks that enable growth and self discovery. When a person makes a mistake that leads to harm, harming that person does not in and of itself lead to growth. Doing something bad and then having something bad happen to you as some “teaching moment” doesn’t actually work. That kind of thinking is the result of this idea that violence is constructive. Society conditions us to believe that violence leads to glory. We deify violence. That is why our criminal justice system is based on punishment. But punitive justice does not result in rehabilitation or personal growth. Such glorification of suffering only serves the interests of the very societal institutions that are breaking the bonds between people. Suffering actually teaches us very little.
Sure, so let’s go deeper into your values and how you think. What important truth do very few people agree with you on?
Can safety in our society actually be provided without police, prisons or surveillance? Many people think this is not possible. However, spending time seriously studying abolitionism changes minds. I have experienced this first hand through my teach-ins. I have had discussions with folks who initially believed abolitionism to be crazy, naïve or just plain stupid, who now believe true safety can only be achieved without our current criminal justice system. The change in mind happens when talking to people sincerely and forming a meaningful relationship with them. I’m not talking at them. I’m not lecturing them. I have conversations with folks, listening to their life experiences and perspectives, genuinely trying to understand their point of view. When you talk to someone with the focus of getting to know the truth of their being, rather than simply trying to win a debate, people will become more open minded and will be more willing to consider other points of view.
Before we go, we’d love to hear your thoughts on some longer-run, legacy type questions. When do you feel most at peace?
I feel most at peace when I get to know people genuinely. Now days with social media, online personas, avatars, and everybody trying to sell you something, it’s more likely that when you do know someone, you only know their agenda. Knowing someone only at surface level is not always bad, however. Life has become so hostile that to protect themselves from harm people only let a small part of themselves be known while keeping most of who they truly are hidden. This is understandable, as our social institutions have us all on high alert and in survival mode most of the time. It just boils down to people’s inability to be vulnerable with each other because no one feels safe and that is a sad reality of our current world. That is why I am thankful when someone does open up to me and allow me to experience their true self. It is a gift which gives me peace. I hope that the Mid-South for Abolition work I do contributes to creating a safer world where people feel less afraid to showcase their true selves.
Contact Info:
- Website: https://midsouth4abolition.wixsite.com/ms4a
- Twitter: https://x.com/MidS4A
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MidS4A
